Once again, I am wondering where and how the Marines are going to get 18 missiles the vehicles for transport, and something to reload the missile truck onshore. If we use Air force C 17s, we need a place to land them. Surly driving all of these vehicles would be noticed. If we bring them onto a beach, we had better select one that can handle these logistic loads, but then we have the load, shoot, pack up and get our butts off to another island and repeat. Someone would surely notice all that driving around and there is again the logistical problem of fuel, beans, and ammo. Another problem is that the NEMESIS only has a 100 mile range. Better to use Naval (including the Marine air) and Air Force aircraft and shoot from long range with the new high precision long range and faster missiles. You might use some troops (Marine Recon, or Navy Seals) landed from a Submarine ala WWII, or from a small fast ship to do the recon and get out the word. We could actually support that both logistically and get them on and then back off the island once the target is taken care of.
"You might use some troops (Marine Recon, or Navy Seals) landed from a Submarine ala WWII, or from a small fast ship to do the recon and get out the word. " - Now that's just crazy talk. Hasn't been cool since '03.
FD2030 relegated the Corps to an island missile asset and rendered the Corps impotent and ineffective to respond to any threats in any place, and ruined our MAGTF capabilities! Our only salvation and restoration lies in VISION2035 to restore our MAGTF lethality and capabilities!!!!
I love it when CP talks logistics. It takes 70+ C-17s to deploy a Patriot Battalion? They don't have any tanks, so logistics should be easy.
The real notable exception at Balikatan 25 is the lack of participation by the HOS Resolution, which is still apparently spending most of it's time aggressively testing anchor technology and experimenting with advanced pier-side operations in Naha. For the money being spent and the relative proximity to the PI, it seems odd not to take advantage of Balikatan to exercise the test ship, even if it seems to be a dud.
A few additional notes: 1) To be fair, the Armed Forces of the Philippines requested the NMESIS this year. (whether it was a 'please ask us to bring this' or not, the request apparently came from the Philippine side).
2) The full command net (operations and sensing-targeting-firing) is apparently being exercised alongside the Philippine forces. This is a very good thing, and has payoff for future ops and concepts regardless. It'd be great if they are integrating with a range of other USMC or Joint assets (air, surface).
Maneuver or missiles? The best definition of “maneuver” is to operate at a “tempo” that implements “the idea to move faster than the enemy can react and to react faster than the enemy can move”. (Ref: Air Power and Maneuver Warfare by Van-Creveld, Canby, and Brower). Maneuver is not sitting on a “littoral” island waiting for the enemy to sail into range of your land-based missiles.
Great Creaser’s Ghost! - how many times does CP have to explain this to the US Marine Corps Commandant, SECNAV, SECDEF, JCOS and the US Army? After all, isn’t naval maneuver essentially the essence of tactical and strategic maneuver?
Keeping in mind, the principle of maneuver “tempo”, how long will it take to complete 70 cargo flights from the Persian Gulf to PACCOM? Probably 5-7 days (and that’s not counting the lead time it will take Air Mobility Command to get that air bridge into place).
Is “US military cargo airlifters (that) recently made over 70 cargo flights from the Pacific to the Middle East” a good idea? A Patriot Battalion is not a MDTF. A Patriot Battalion consists of four to five batteries, each battery has four to six launchers” and includes radar systems, command vehicles, and support vehicles for logistics and maintenance. The number of C17s to move this airlift requirement beast is more than 70 C17s. I can also guarantee that the requirement will grow to the point that USTRANSCOM will push back and tell the Combatant Commander, we can get your Patriot Missile Battalion (Persian Gulf to PACOM) to you earlier with a fast RORO Ship. In addition, the Combatant Commander will need to make major changes to his airlift deployment priorities.
A RORO ship can sail from Guam to Manila in 3 to 5 days. Why don’t we establish and expand a MPF squadron in Guam containing not only US Marine Gear but also the MDTF gear? Strategic war planning is not “Rocket Science” just because we are talking about missiles. S/F
ITS JFA the Chinese watched island hopping in WWII. We have not been successful in war unless its complete domination or complete anailanation. So dominate or put boots on the ground. We stopped jousting in the middle ages, except for Russia and Ukraine recently. Bring the MEB, MSGTAF, back with supporting arms and give commander the punch to succeed. Maybe and improved lite Tank.
Once again, I am wondering where and how the Marines are going to get 18 missiles the vehicles for transport, and something to reload the missile truck onshore. If we use Air force C 17s, we need a place to land them. Surly driving all of these vehicles would be noticed. If we bring them onto a beach, we had better select one that can handle these logistic loads, but then we have the load, shoot, pack up and get our butts off to another island and repeat. Someone would surely notice all that driving around and there is again the logistical problem of fuel, beans, and ammo. Another problem is that the NEMESIS only has a 100 mile range. Better to use Naval (including the Marine air) and Air Force aircraft and shoot from long range with the new high precision long range and faster missiles. You might use some troops (Marine Recon, or Navy Seals) landed from a Submarine ala WWII, or from a small fast ship to do the recon and get out the word. We could actually support that both logistically and get them on and then back off the island once the target is taken care of.
"You might use some troops (Marine Recon, or Navy Seals) landed from a Submarine ala WWII, or from a small fast ship to do the recon and get out the word. " - Now that's just crazy talk. Hasn't been cool since '03.
Yeah, but then I was in the Corps 1960-1968, still have non cool thoughts.
FD2030 relegated the Corps to an island missile asset and rendered the Corps impotent and ineffective to respond to any threats in any place, and ruined our MAGTF capabilities! Our only salvation and restoration lies in VISION2035 to restore our MAGTF lethality and capabilities!!!!
https://open.substack.com/pub/cpldanusmcret764175/p/maneuver-or-missiles?r=ohc7t&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web&showWelcomeOnShare=true
If they listen Oooh-rahh
I love it when CP talks logistics. It takes 70+ C-17s to deploy a Patriot Battalion? They don't have any tanks, so logistics should be easy.
The real notable exception at Balikatan 25 is the lack of participation by the HOS Resolution, which is still apparently spending most of it's time aggressively testing anchor technology and experimenting with advanced pier-side operations in Naha. For the money being spent and the relative proximity to the PI, it seems odd not to take advantage of Balikatan to exercise the test ship, even if it seems to be a dud.
A few additional notes: 1) To be fair, the Armed Forces of the Philippines requested the NMESIS this year. (whether it was a 'please ask us to bring this' or not, the request apparently came from the Philippine side).
2) The full command net (operations and sensing-targeting-firing) is apparently being exercised alongside the Philippine forces. This is a very good thing, and has payoff for future ops and concepts regardless. It'd be great if they are integrating with a range of other USMC or Joint assets (air, surface).
(source for Notes 1 and 2: https://www.3rdmlr.marines.mil/Media-Room/Stories/Article/Article/4156666/3d-mlr-deploys-nmesis-to-philippines-for-exercise-balikatan-25/)
Maneuver or missiles? The best definition of “maneuver” is to operate at a “tempo” that implements “the idea to move faster than the enemy can react and to react faster than the enemy can move”. (Ref: Air Power and Maneuver Warfare by Van-Creveld, Canby, and Brower). Maneuver is not sitting on a “littoral” island waiting for the enemy to sail into range of your land-based missiles.
Great Creaser’s Ghost! - how many times does CP have to explain this to the US Marine Corps Commandant, SECNAV, SECDEF, JCOS and the US Army? After all, isn’t naval maneuver essentially the essence of tactical and strategic maneuver?
Keeping in mind, the principle of maneuver “tempo”, how long will it take to complete 70 cargo flights from the Persian Gulf to PACCOM? Probably 5-7 days (and that’s not counting the lead time it will take Air Mobility Command to get that air bridge into place).
Is “US military cargo airlifters (that) recently made over 70 cargo flights from the Pacific to the Middle East” a good idea? A Patriot Battalion is not a MDTF. A Patriot Battalion consists of four to five batteries, each battery has four to six launchers” and includes radar systems, command vehicles, and support vehicles for logistics and maintenance. The number of C17s to move this airlift requirement beast is more than 70 C17s. I can also guarantee that the requirement will grow to the point that USTRANSCOM will push back and tell the Combatant Commander, we can get your Patriot Missile Battalion (Persian Gulf to PACOM) to you earlier with a fast RORO Ship. In addition, the Combatant Commander will need to make major changes to his airlift deployment priorities.
A RORO ship can sail from Guam to Manila in 3 to 5 days. Why don’t we establish and expand a MPF squadron in Guam containing not only US Marine Gear but also the MDTF gear? Strategic war planning is not “Rocket Science” just because we are talking about missiles. S/F
Good point....takes us back to having to face the sick man that is MSC.
The people that came up with this missile scheme remind me of the villains in the 1996 Sean Connery movie "The Rock. " https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UkrDEnzIS8
Couch cushion raiders vs General Gray’s Warrior CRUSH
https://open.substack.com/pub/cpldanusmcret764175/p/maneuver-or-missiles?r=ohc7t&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web&showWelcomeOnShare=true
ITS JFA the Chinese watched island hopping in WWII. We have not been successful in war unless its complete domination or complete anailanation. So dominate or put boots on the ground. We stopped jousting in the middle ages, except for Russia and Ukraine recently. Bring the MEB, MSGTAF, back with supporting arms and give commander the punch to succeed. Maybe and improved lite Tank.
Lash Sends
That's MAGTF 👍🏻