Let me suggest the book The Jungle in Neutral by Chapman. Surviving in Malaysian coastal regions on minimal logistical support is a nightmare scenario and not for the faint of heart. Just small arms and limited ammunition become a huge burden. Initial EABO suggested living off of the land and purchases from locals. Don’t hear much about that any more. Logistics is the base consideration and I have yet to see a viable solution. “Not logistically supportable” has killed many a course of action.
It is time to put this fantasy to rest. Not a Marine mission, all other services can do it better, the USMC can do it better with Quicksink bombs carried by F-35’s and the concept is not logistically supportable. The SecNav needs to step up and put this to rest. Time to send some people into retirement.
The Marines are running out of sound ideas on how to position, reposition, and logistically support (including emergency medical evacuation) isolated and widely dispersed SIFs. Instead of admitting that logistics is a bridge too far and changing operational concepts, the senior leadership buries their collective heads in the sand and plows forward to the inevitable cliff.
I find myself rapidly losing respect for the flag officer(s) who made the batch of errors not now so much for the initial errors but for the neglect/delay/ obdurant refusal to be accountable. Real leaders step up and hold themselves responsible and initiate corrective ACTION.
The so-called "narco boat" carries the equivalent of one truck. Can you even imagine a convoy of these boats? One day Marine leaders are bound to wake up and recognize what any professional realizes--only ships can carry the supplies needed by a ground force of any size. Marines used to know a little about logistics and naval operations, now they apparently fantasize.
"Generals are a happy blessed race who radiate confidence and power. They feed only on ambrosia and drink only nectar. In peace, they stride confidently and can invade a world simply by sweeping their hands grandly over a map, point their fingers decisively up terrain corridors, and blocking defiles and obstacles with the sides of their hands. In war, they must stride more slowly because each general has a logistician riding on his back and he knows that, at any moment, the logistician may lean forward and whisper: "No, you can't do that."
I believe CMC Smith needs to study the Battle of Guadalcanal (our own history). There is a reason why it was called Starvation Island, and it has to do with a lack of supplies.
pushing past rabaul we bypassed japanese forces on new ireland, iirc. win without fighting. starvation works well. i suppose we’ll have to relearn several not so obvious lessons the hard way.
"... the proposed vignettes will each require significant logistical support to provide an enduring presence. Furthermore, the anticipated scale of EABO means simultaneous execution of the vignettes. The result is that their logistics requirements are additive, there is no economy of scale to be gained, and they will likely compete for priority of logistics support." - Major Daniel Katzma nails it with this summation.
There's few people alive today that served in a war where America didn't control the air space. We need to plan on not having air superiority. Look at the Ukraine-Russia war. A much smaller country has kept a declining super power from overflying the line of combat. All that Russia has been able to do is fire rockets or filing bombs from a distance.
China will be tougher than Russia until we can degrade their PLA air force and triple A. Does America even have enough weapons to do that. America is a declining power, too. I keep reading we have enough of a missile stockpile to only fight for 2 weeks.
And planners think they can use resupply vessels for Marines left on small islands. Sounds worse than Guadalcanal to me.
If I understand the current US Joint Military situation, the US Army can now fielded the Multi-Domain Task Force (MDTF) in response to the US strategic shift towards the CCP Pacific threat (See CP-Ode to HEMETT). The US Air Force has just completed the activation of "the last of its first six Air Task Forces" (See CP-Wild Blue Yonder). The US Navy now has a solution to reload the missile tubes of their Alleigh-Burk Destroyer at sea. In addition, the US Navy now has a “Quick-Sink” anti-ship program (See CP-That Sinking Feeling). The US Marine Corps has fielded the MLR with short range anti-ship missiles (See-CP Missile Mistake) that is going to be deployed by small amphibs yet to be built, supplied by experimental “narco-boats” with the cargo capacity of a 5 ton truck (See CP-Narco Boat Hits Oki). In addition, the current Commandant is making the empty boost that the US Marine Corps is the eyes and ears of the Joint Force. Read General McKenzie’s book “The Melting Point” to understand where the real eyes and ears of the Joint Force reside. (In many ways this book is a study of the Combatant Commander’s C&C capabilities.) We have an election coming up that will provide a new administration, is it time for Chowder II to visit Capitol Hill with recommendations for a new Commandant that understands the US Marine Corps Development system? … and how to coordinate with the strategic focus of the Joint Military System?
Big picture, I have wondered why the Marines keep trying to eat a mission tje navy should want and could do better from the water. However, I do like the idea of getting lighter and getting serious about how unmanned can help. The obsession w narco subs is off. They are single use platforms with a great business case as the street value of 8 tons of coke makes way more sense than sneaking in 8 tons of gas. We could build some stealth supply landing boats based on a commercial planing hull for way less and have lots of them. They can make their way between islands in a single period of darkness and deliver about a c-130s worth of supplies. This could be scaled up to an FSV sized platform like OUSV- 3 Vanguad and deliver 300-500 tons per load making about 25 knots sustained and have them land the gear via stern ramp. Scale it up one final step to an EPF afain designed for speed and stealth and get 1000 tons in if using a more modern hull like the one selected for the EMS.
Let me suggest the book The Jungle in Neutral by Chapman. Surviving in Malaysian coastal regions on minimal logistical support is a nightmare scenario and not for the faint of heart. Just small arms and limited ammunition become a huge burden. Initial EABO suggested living off of the land and purchases from locals. Don’t hear much about that any more. Logistics is the base consideration and I have yet to see a viable solution. “Not logistically supportable” has killed many a course of action.
It is time to put this fantasy to rest. Not a Marine mission, all other services can do it better, the USMC can do it better with Quicksink bombs carried by F-35’s and the concept is not logistically supportable. The SecNav needs to step up and put this to rest. Time to send some people into retirement.
The Marines are running out of sound ideas on how to position, reposition, and logistically support (including emergency medical evacuation) isolated and widely dispersed SIFs. Instead of admitting that logistics is a bridge too far and changing operational concepts, the senior leadership buries their collective heads in the sand and plows forward to the inevitable cliff.
They cannot bear the thought that they were wrong and it is not feasible to do this. So they keep digging.
They're in a hole an can't figure a way out. They need to admit a mistake was made (accountability), and get back to the combined arms MEU.
I find myself rapidly losing respect for the flag officer(s) who made the batch of errors not now so much for the initial errors but for the neglect/delay/ obdurant refusal to be accountable. Real leaders step up and hold themselves responsible and initiate corrective ACTION.
Yup! Accountability!
They can't admit it....so they keep blazing the path to irrelevancy.
The so-called "narco boat" carries the equivalent of one truck. Can you even imagine a convoy of these boats? One day Marine leaders are bound to wake up and recognize what any professional realizes--only ships can carry the supplies needed by a ground force of any size. Marines used to know a little about logistics and naval operations, now they apparently fantasize.
"Generals are a happy blessed race who radiate confidence and power. They feed only on ambrosia and drink only nectar. In peace, they stride confidently and can invade a world simply by sweeping their hands grandly over a map, point their fingers decisively up terrain corridors, and blocking defiles and obstacles with the sides of their hands. In war, they must stride more slowly because each general has a logistician riding on his back and he knows that, at any moment, the logistician may lean forward and whisper: "No, you can't do that."
I believe CMC Smith needs to study the Battle of Guadalcanal (our own history). There is a reason why it was called Starvation Island, and it has to do with a lack of supplies.
pushing past rabaul we bypassed japanese forces on new ireland, iirc. win without fighting. starvation works well. i suppose we’ll have to relearn several not so obvious lessons the hard way.
"... the proposed vignettes will each require significant logistical support to provide an enduring presence. Furthermore, the anticipated scale of EABO means simultaneous execution of the vignettes. The result is that their logistics requirements are additive, there is no economy of scale to be gained, and they will likely compete for priority of logistics support." - Major Daniel Katzma nails it with this summation.
There's few people alive today that served in a war where America didn't control the air space. We need to plan on not having air superiority. Look at the Ukraine-Russia war. A much smaller country has kept a declining super power from overflying the line of combat. All that Russia has been able to do is fire rockets or filing bombs from a distance.
China will be tougher than Russia until we can degrade their PLA air force and triple A. Does America even have enough weapons to do that. America is a declining power, too. I keep reading we have enough of a missile stockpile to only fight for 2 weeks.
And planners think they can use resupply vessels for Marines left on small islands. Sounds worse than Guadalcanal to me.
If I understand the current US Joint Military situation, the US Army can now fielded the Multi-Domain Task Force (MDTF) in response to the US strategic shift towards the CCP Pacific threat (See CP-Ode to HEMETT). The US Air Force has just completed the activation of "the last of its first six Air Task Forces" (See CP-Wild Blue Yonder). The US Navy now has a solution to reload the missile tubes of their Alleigh-Burk Destroyer at sea. In addition, the US Navy now has a “Quick-Sink” anti-ship program (See CP-That Sinking Feeling). The US Marine Corps has fielded the MLR with short range anti-ship missiles (See-CP Missile Mistake) that is going to be deployed by small amphibs yet to be built, supplied by experimental “narco-boats” with the cargo capacity of a 5 ton truck (See CP-Narco Boat Hits Oki). In addition, the current Commandant is making the empty boost that the US Marine Corps is the eyes and ears of the Joint Force. Read General McKenzie’s book “The Melting Point” to understand where the real eyes and ears of the Joint Force reside. (In many ways this book is a study of the Combatant Commander’s C&C capabilities.) We have an election coming up that will provide a new administration, is it time for Chowder II to visit Capitol Hill with recommendations for a new Commandant that understands the US Marine Corps Development system? … and how to coordinate with the strategic focus of the Joint Military System?
Big picture, I have wondered why the Marines keep trying to eat a mission tje navy should want and could do better from the water. However, I do like the idea of getting lighter and getting serious about how unmanned can help. The obsession w narco subs is off. They are single use platforms with a great business case as the street value of 8 tons of coke makes way more sense than sneaking in 8 tons of gas. We could build some stealth supply landing boats based on a commercial planing hull for way less and have lots of them. They can make their way between islands in a single period of darkness and deliver about a c-130s worth of supplies. This could be scaled up to an FSV sized platform like OUSV- 3 Vanguad and deliver 300-500 tons per load making about 25 knots sustained and have them land the gear via stern ramp. Scale it up one final step to an EPF afain designed for speed and stealth and get 1000 tons in if using a more modern hull like the one selected for the EMS.
https://spectator.org/the-marine-corps-has-gone-off-the-rails/
Col. Gary Anderson hits the ball out of the park with his FD analysis, again!